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Author Topic: Some parametric window questions  (Read 1456 times)

GT4505

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Some parametric window questions
« on: August 12, 2016, 01:07:57 AM »
Hi there,

I've decided to call this thread as such because I'm working on some parametric window sets.
As for now I'm working on something quite specific which I can't seem to get right, but I guess other questions regarding windows will follow :p

As you can see, I've started from the itoo window tutorial, because that seemed to be the easiest way.
However the window I'd like to generate is different, with a vertical element reaching from top to bottom, and a second element split in 2.
Please have a look at my max file, you'll find a "basic"model of the window in the jpg, sliced up in the needed parts.

One other question, not direcly related to this specific window shape is if there is a possibility to generate windows based on a clipping area, and add some variation by opening some of the windows (both axes mixed togather: opened over z-axis, or x-axis).
I used to do this with the linear spline generator, but as I'm trying to generate my windows with the A2S generator, this seems to be much more difficult.

Thanks for the advice.
Pieter
Pieter van Stee

GT4505

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2016, 11:30:20 AM »
Great, after quite some testing and another approach it seems to work right now...
Pieter van Stee

Paul Roberts

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2016, 12:18:43 PM »
You beat me to it :)

I've attached my version anyway. Basically it uses a lot of sequence operators, a few arithmetic operators to calculate the sizes of the segments and a love of jigsaws :)

You might also be interested in this thread if you're doing a lot of windows, there are a number of questions answered here including sample files. http://forum.itoosoft.com/index.php?topic=3320.msg13403#msg13403

I hope that helps.

Many thanks!

Paul
Paul Roberts
iToo Software

GT4505

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2016, 01:08:17 PM »
Hi, thank you for your fixed version, always good to learn!
I first started with your tutorial in mind, using all the segments as corners top and bottom... But this seemed to make it more complicated for me.
I'll have a look at your solution in a moment to see how you solved it.
The main solution I'm using now, are just vertical strips one left, one right, and a composition of three parts for the middel, all in vertical sequences...
Also thanks for the link to the thread.

However I've still one bigger question that I'd like to use for all my other window generators:
Is there a possibility to generate the window, with one part that can open (slightly), to add some variation if you've got a lot of windows.
In these A2S generators this seems especially hard.

An other problem I've still got with a sliding door window generator is that I'd like to open some of the panels randomly.
Therefore I'd need a random number, that should change per segment (let's say 4 squares in the total clipping area). So that would mean I'd need a generated number for each square (window). But changing the generate from start (where they all have the same opening distance) seems to mess with the window model.

Thank you,
Pieter
Pieter van Stee

Paul Roberts

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2016, 06:14:43 PM »
Hi Pieter,

Would you mind sending me your model for the sliding door to take a look at? It's be easier for me to come up with a solution that works for your set-up that way.

Many thanks!

Paul
Paul Roberts
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GT4505

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2016, 02:32:15 AM »
Thank you for your reply, I'll send that to you soon.
In the meantime I'm working on an other window I'd like to use in a current project.

I'm encountering some problems here:
- Getting the uv's mapped correctly which are running across different elements.
- Getting the info from the XSectionLength which is returning 0,000
   I was trying to use this to line the sun shade beams in front of one window segment (maybe there is just an easier way to do that?)

I've attached the model I'm working with, and also some screenshots to illustrate.
All the files can be downloaded here: http://gofile.me/6lvtX/9aZkTbI7o

Thanks in advance,
Pieter van Stee
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Pieter van Stee

Paul Roberts

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2016, 02:15:41 PM »
Hi Pieter,

Thanks for the files, that style is looking good! There are some issues it would seem with UVW lining up correctly on the Y axis, especially when segments are scaled. I'll talk to our development team about this to see if it can be improved. In the meantime how about using V-Ray's new Triplanar texture map? It works well in my tests and prevents you from having to fiddle around in RailClone with UVW mapping.



I've used this in the attached file.

To add the Sun Shade beams I've created a condition using an expression that tests a segments current position on the spline against the length of an XSectionLength. This seems to work well and allows you to choose how many windows you'd like to cover with sun shades. You also notice that I've connected the padding values to the height of the Sun Shades so that their height can be calculated automatically.

I hope that helps, please let me know if you have any further questions.

Many Thanks,

Paul
Paul Roberts
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GT4505

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2016, 11:58:24 PM »
Hi Paul,

That's a great fix for my uv problem, that fixes it all!
Also the shading is working very nice now.

I've created a new folder in the shared link from my previous post.
If you'd like to have a look at my RCstyle, because I'm trying to generate windows on a single spline (rather than rectangles).
It has the advantage that you can use your single spline style around the building, and not just in one direction with the clipping principle.
So I've started with this style that has a middle (default, scaleable part), just as the last style.
Only with this one, and all my future window styles I'd like to place dummy planes in my openings to get the heights from the windows into the RCstyle.
You'll see that I've placed 8 placeholders or so in RC...

With a selector I'd like to use them to generate the different heights for the different types of openings.
Hope that seems logic to you.
In the folder are some screenshots from the frame buffer so you can see how it's coming along.

Thanks for the support.
Pieter
Pieter van Stee

GT4505

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2016, 05:33:16 PM »
Hi, I'd like to come back on my last question as it isn't answered yet, and now I would need that workflow again.

So I have a basic script for my windows...
But I'd like to use this basic script for different heights. These heights should be generated by simple planes I can set up in the scene and modify when needed, so it's easy, quick and always accurate.

I'd like to assign some id's to different splines, let's say 1,2,3
And create 3 surfaces that are brought into the script with a segment.
These segments should be plugged into a selector...

All this works fine it seems, the only thing I still can't get to work is the total height which is plugged into the y-size of the A2S generator.
But the overall height of the windows isn't changing.
Is there any way to get this working?

Thanks
Pieter van Stee

Paul Roberts

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2016, 07:00:06 PM »
Hi Pieter,

Would you mind uploading the version you have so far so I can take a look? Unfortunately only one Y Size can be used  per RC object, it can't be adjusted for each spline, but maybe I can find another way.

Many thanks,

Paul
Paul Roberts
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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2016, 09:14:58 PM »
Hi, Paul

If that would be possible that would be great!
I've attached the max model.

Pieter van Stee

Paul Roberts

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2016, 11:23:33 AM »
Hi!

Thanks for the file. I've attached a possible solution. There are a couple of limitation when using the A2S array for this purpose. Firstly as mentioned, the Y Size parameter affects all parts of the array, even if they're on different spline sections so it can't be used to dynamically adjust the height. Secondly, row heights will always align, even if they too are on different splines, so it isn't possible to scale the segments to change the window height because the row above will always move to contain the tallest segment.

To get around this I've created the whole thing with 3 L1S generators: One for the bottom, one for the mid section, and one for the top. This is replicating an A2S array, but without any of those limitations. Using this style you should be able to control the height of windows using material IDs.

I hope that helps, please let me know if you have any further questions.

Many Thanks,

Paul
« Last Edit: September 21, 2016, 10:10:58 AM by Paul Roberts »
Paul Roberts
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GT4505

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #12 on: September 20, 2016, 08:06:59 PM »
No problem about the A2S because I didn't liked it anyway for these kind of objects.

At first I started following the window tutorial on the itoo website.
It's a good method, but lacking some functionality especially because it can only be used in one direction at once.
Is there a possibility to use that more in the way I'm using it on a spline so it can be used in all directions with a more complex window composition?
Also a good addition to rc would be to link different rc obj's? If you had to split up some objects (like these windows) so that if you make changes on one, they reflect to other rc objs...

But for now, my problem seems to be fixed.
Thank you for the solution!
Pieter van Stee

GT4505

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #13 on: September 20, 2016, 08:14:26 PM »
By the way,

Is it possible you've attached an old max file? from one of your earlier posts?
Pieter van Stee

Paul Roberts

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Re: Some parametric window questions
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2016, 10:13:51 AM »
Hi, Thanks for spotting that, you're right I uploaded an old file. I've fixed it in the original post.

You might be interested to know that we're working on the Clipping>Extend X/Y Size to area functionality at the moment and it should be possible to use it with multiple directions in RailClone 3.

Thanks!

Paul
Paul Roberts
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